tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7610233.post8722131294514395632..comments2023-06-19T04:16:51.117-07:00Comments on buggieboy: The Last Full Measure of Devotion - at a discount rateJ.D.http://www.blogger.com/profile/09027687985747914971noreply@blogger.comBlogger7125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7610233.post-76172479467116832352008-06-30T06:13:00.000-07:002008-06-30T06:13:00.000-07:00bg: "I know I am dreaming here, but perhaps this ...bg: "I know I am dreaming here, but perhaps this could be a lesson learned from this war."<BR/><BR/>Each of the armed forces has an institutional mechanism for learning lessons from their operations. Unfortunately, neither the executive branch or the legislative branch have such an institutionalized facility.<BR/><BR/>IOF was conducted in a manner totally inconsistent with Army doctrine. Has this "lesson" been learned? Three years into the post "Mission Accomplished" period, and Rummy and Co still saw nothing wrong with the lack of a coherent Phase IV plan, no less the patheticly small force package.<BR/><BR/>Now, whether or not anyone acts on the "lessons learned" actions of the military is a separate issue, but at least we have put the mechanism in place. When you have an executive who states over and over again that he has never made a significant mistake, it is clear that learning is not on the agenda.<BR/><BR/>AlAviator47https://www.blogger.com/profile/05585964386930142907noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7610233.post-91163112888565396472008-06-29T06:49:00.000-07:002008-06-29T06:49:00.000-07:00Al,I agree, I know, I was there. Before the invas...Al,<BR/><BR/>I agree, I know, I was there. Before the invasion, we were constantly asking questions about how long we would be there, and everyone at all levels insisted that it would be like Desert Storm. A few hours of fighting, a few months of clean up, and almost everyone would be home by Sep. That was the plan, and it was generally accepted by all from CFLCC down.<BR/><BR/>I think if we had a law that required full mob, it would be retroactive. In other words, Rummy can have his 12 months to conduct the "limited" action, but if after 12 months, if a certain level of commitment is still required, the law should force the President and Congress to either order a full mobilization, or a withdrawal to a much lower, sustainable level (a level predetermined by the law which should purposively be so low that no war could be fought). <BR/><BR/>I know I am dreaming here, but perhaps this could be a lesson learned from this war.bghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08514579328273641457noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7610233.post-9498612246872442692008-06-28T21:53:00.000-07:002008-06-28T21:53:00.000-07:00bg-IIRC, Rummy & Co said OIF would be a few months...bg-<BR/><BR/>IIRC, Rummy & Co said OIF would be a few months. No need to mobilize. Congress simply gave the administration what it asked for at first. Real questions weren't raised until the folly of it all became apparent.<BR/><BR/>"War on the Cheap" just doesn't work, especially when it's a very questionable war at that.<BR/><BR/>AlAviator47https://www.blogger.com/profile/05585964386930142907noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7610233.post-43881216865796536592008-06-28T20:09:00.000-07:002008-06-28T20:09:00.000-07:00BG,I don't think there is any way we would have at...BG,<BR/><BR/>I don't think there is any way we would have attacked Iraq if your proposal was law. I'm all for it.<BR/><BR/>No more going to war without total commitment. Just think of all the wars we would have avoided.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7610233.post-669005687123486772008-06-27T14:39:00.000-07:002008-06-27T14:39:00.000-07:00" In short, how can we get the American people to ..." In short, how can we get the American people to take this seriously if there is no draft, no way of having everyone contribute to the common good?"<BR/><BR/>If I remember my history correct, the only way we were able to do it in WWII was because we forced it upon the people with a draft and other war measures that affected the daily lives of every American.<BR/><BR/>I don't understand why congress can authorize the country to go to war without also authorizing a full mobilization of the country. ISTM that full mobilization, i.e., draft, war bonds, etc, should be part of the package. You go all the way, or not at all. When the U.S. government decides to make a commitment of troops that will last longer than a year, there should be a law that requires full mobilization (and all that entails), or withdrawal.bghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08514579328273641457noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7610233.post-50425251240368180652008-06-26T12:36:00.000-07:002008-06-26T12:36:00.000-07:00i am the only person in my circle of friends and o...i am the only person in my circle of friends and one of two people in my office of 25 who has had a close relative in Iraq/Afghanistan--my officemate has a nephew; I have a stepson and grandson who have a combined 5 tours of Iraq. I also have another grandson who is joining the Marine reserves, with the plan to go active after his freshman year at college is done. Needless to say, I feel like my family has given quite a bit, but we've been especially blessed--especially because so far no one's been hurt despite being deployed to Anbar and Diyala provinces during particularly hairy times. <BR/><BR/>As much as I don't want to see anyone else go in the meat grinder, I agree with JD. If this war is the chosen foreign policy of this country, and this war is part of the "global war on terror," where is the sense of moral obligation? In short, how can we get the American people to take this seriously if there is no draft, no way of having everyone contribute to the common good? If nothing else, perhaps a national conversation about the draft would force us all to examine what the hell we're doing uninvited in countries halfway around the world. As far as I can tell, Americans have stopped talking about iraq/afghanistan and the media doesn't even report on it anymore. Our people in uniform are treated like mercenaries by the government that sent them, and Americans can't even look up from their TVs long enough to notice.<BR/> <BR/>Sad days indeed for the good ol' USA.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7610233.post-74426081130809868802008-06-26T08:16:00.000-07:002008-06-26T08:16:00.000-07:00"If our nation thinks the way to wage wars is to s..."If our nation thinks the way to wage wars is to send the same men again and again and again and again while the rest of us continue to party, we have become an evil and despicable people."<BR/><BR/>Well, yeah...that's it right there. I work with a number of Bush-loving war supporters, but none of their military-age children are in service or planning to serve. They wave flags and put stickers on their cars and that's it. The hypoccisy is stunning, but after all how can I really blame them when that's all their beloved leader who gets his info straight from God has asked them to do. That and go shopping.<BR/><BR/>I would have agreed with you about the draft a few years ago, but I am so sick at heart by now about the mindless insanity of it all that the idea of anyone being killed, maimed or stuck with PTSD for life from this war of choice that didn't "sign on the dotted line" knowing full well what they were getting into horrifies me far worse than what you describe. Your plan should indeed be the requirement for future conflicts, but we have to bring the current unending slow bleed to an end first.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com